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	<title>Comments on: Tidal Power Flowing Stronger</title>
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	<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/</link>
	<description>Seeking Hope Amidst the Climate Conundrum</description>
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		<title>By: Gerard</title>
		<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/#comment-542</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gerard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 00:04:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://carbonnation.info/?p=563#comment-542</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Right. We have to be careful apparently about what energy websites are/aren&#039;t including in their data. However, initially I was not trying to necessarily include all energies rather I was just trying out some of the &#039;goods&#039;.

I tried that EIA site and was able to make some interesting graphs with the Excel data they provide. I think they answer many of the trend questions I had asked. 

Thanks for pointing me to that site.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right. We have to be careful apparently about what energy websites are/aren&#8217;t including in their data. However, initially I was not trying to necessarily include all energies rather I was just trying out some of the &#8216;goods&#8217;.</p>
<p>I tried that EIA site and was able to make some interesting graphs with the Excel data they provide. I think they answer many of the trend questions I had asked. </p>
<p>Thanks for pointing me to that site.</p>
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		<title>By: pfairley</title>
		<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/#comment-536</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[pfairley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 09:03:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://carbonnation.info/?p=563#comment-536</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for that resource Gerard. We just need to be careful to check the fine print. In trying to figure out where renewables fit in to that BP data, I discovered the following footnote: &quot;In this Review, primary energy comprises commercially traded fuels only. Excluded, therefore, are fuels such as wood, peat and animal waste which, though important in many countries, are unreliably documented in terms of consumption statistics. Also excluded are wind, geothermal and solar power generation.&quot; 

I don&#039;t buy either point. First off, there are major questions about the numbers for natural gas and oil. For example, disputes over how much natural gas Russia ships to Ukraine and how much Ukraine extracts before shipping it south to Europe is at the heart of the recurring natural gas supply disruptions afflicting Europe. 

As for excluding wind, geothermal and solar power generation: Why does BP include hydropower in its data if it is then going to exclude other sources of renewable electricity?

An alternative source if you really want to dig into data is the U.S. Department of Energy&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.eia.doe.gov/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Energy Information Agency website&lt;/a&gt;, which is a data goldmine. See the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.eia.doe.gov/iea/overview.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;World Energy Overview&lt;/a&gt; for one starting point. Note that the EIA overview&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/international/iealf/table29.xls&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Table 2.9 on world primary energy production&lt;/a&gt; presents renewables other than hydro as a separate category.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for that resource Gerard. We just need to be careful to check the fine print. In trying to figure out where renewables fit in to that BP data, I discovered the following footnote: &#8220;In this Review, primary energy comprises commercially traded fuels only. Excluded, therefore, are fuels such as wood, peat and animal waste which, though important in many countries, are unreliably documented in terms of consumption statistics. Also excluded are wind, geothermal and solar power generation.&#8221; </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t buy either point. First off, there are major questions about the numbers for natural gas and oil. For example, disputes over how much natural gas Russia ships to Ukraine and how much Ukraine extracts before shipping it south to Europe is at the heart of the recurring natural gas supply disruptions afflicting Europe. </p>
<p>As for excluding wind, geothermal and solar power generation: Why does BP include hydropower in its data if it is then going to exclude other sources of renewable electricity?</p>
<p>An alternative source if you really want to dig into data is the U.S. Department of Energy&#8217;s <a href="http://www.eia.doe.gov/" rel="nofollow">Energy Information Agency website</a>, which is a data goldmine. See the <a href="http://www.eia.doe.gov/iea/overview.html" rel="nofollow">World Energy Overview</a> for one starting point. Note that the EIA overview&#8217;s <a href="http://www.eia.doe.gov/pub/international/iealf/table29.xls" rel="nofollow">Table 2.9 on world primary energy production</a> presents renewables other than hydro as a separate category.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Gerard</title>
		<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/#comment-535</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gerard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 01:21:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://carbonnation.info/?p=563#comment-535</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I did a search on &quot;world energy usage&quot; and got some useful sites. However i liked the following URL at BP:  http://www.bp.com/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9023766&amp;contentId=7044197 because it had an Excel dataset that you could download with many different types of data. To make best use of this requires installing the histogram capability into Excel (this is easy to do just go to help in Excel). I get for example for the total world energy use binned by energy use:

Bin	Frequency
0	0
1000	0
2000	0
3000	0
4000	1
5000	5
6000	5
7000	9
8000	4
9000	10
10000	5
more    4

This has an interesting behavior when we consider that energy usage has an approximately linear (found by graphing the dataset)increase over time. But apparently the usage lately has bucked that trend and energy usage is now increasing more than average.


Gerard]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did a search on &#8220;world energy usage&#8221; and got some useful sites. However i liked the following URL at BP:  <a href="http://www.bp.com/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9023766&#038;contentId=7044197" rel="nofollow">http://www.bp.com/sectiongenericarticle.do?categoryId=9023766&#038;contentId=7044197</a> because it had an Excel dataset that you could download with many different types of data. To make best use of this requires installing the histogram capability into Excel (this is easy to do just go to help in Excel). I get for example for the total world energy use binned by energy use:</p>
<p>Bin	Frequency<br />
0	0<br />
1000	0<br />
2000	0<br />
3000	0<br />
4000	1<br />
5000	5<br />
6000	5<br />
7000	9<br />
8000	4<br />
9000	10<br />
10000	5<br />
more    4</p>
<p>This has an interesting behavior when we consider that energy usage has an approximately linear (found by graphing the dataset)increase over time. But apparently the usage lately has bucked that trend and energy usage is now increasing more than average.</p>
<p>Gerard</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: pfairley</title>
		<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/#comment-531</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[pfairley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 08:12:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://carbonnation.info/?p=563#comment-531</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I come across such histograms from time to time and will try to dig some up. Perhaps you could do a Google search or two and post what you find? 

Regarding your questions about the development path of tidal power, its similarities to wind power certainly help. In a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.technologyreview.com/energy/18567/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;2007 story for Technology Review&lt;/a&gt; I reported found that: 
&lt;blockquote&gt;Thanks to lessons learned by wind turbine designers, tidal power is already economically competitive, producing electricity at prices similar to wind power, according to feasibility studies by the Electric Power Research Institute, an industry R&amp;D consortium. And it offers a big advantage over wind and other renewables: a precisely predictable source of energy.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
As for the potential impact of tidal energy, here are some useful comments from British authorities aggregated by the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bwea.com/marine/resource.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;British Wind Energy Association&lt;/a&gt;: 
&lt;blockquote&gt;The World Offshore Renewable Energy Report 2002-2007...suggests that while a staggering 3000GW of tidal energy is estimated to be available, less than 3% is located in areas suitable for power generation. Tidal current energy is therefore very site specific, optimized only where tidal range is amplified by factors such as shelving of the sea bottom, funnelling in estuaries and reflections by large peninsulas...However, Scottish Enterprise comment that it is estimated that at least 34% of the UK&#039;s electricity demand could be generated from tidal currents, which on a European level would be a contribution of nearly 5%.&lt;/blockquote&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I come across such histograms from time to time and will try to dig some up. Perhaps you could do a Google search or two and post what you find? </p>
<p>Regarding your questions about the development path of tidal power, its similarities to wind power certainly help. In a <a href="http://www.technologyreview.com/energy/18567/" rel="nofollow">2007 story for Technology Review</a> I reported found that: </p>
<blockquote><p>Thanks to lessons learned by wind turbine designers, tidal power is already economically competitive, producing electricity at prices similar to wind power, according to feasibility studies by the Electric Power Research Institute, an industry R&amp;D consortium. And it offers a big advantage over wind and other renewables: a precisely predictable source of energy.</p></blockquote>
<p>As for the potential impact of tidal energy, here are some useful comments from British authorities aggregated by the <a href="http://www.bwea.com/marine/resource.html" rel="nofollow">British Wind Energy Association</a>: </p>
<blockquote><p>The World Offshore Renewable Energy Report 2002-2007&#8230;suggests that while a staggering 3000GW of tidal energy is estimated to be available, less than 3% is located in areas suitable for power generation. Tidal current energy is therefore very site specific, optimized only where tidal range is amplified by factors such as shelving of the sea bottom, funnelling in estuaries and reflections by large peninsulas&#8230;However, Scottish Enterprise comment that it is estimated that at least 34% of the UK&#8217;s electricity demand could be generated from tidal currents, which on a European level would be a contribution of nearly 5%.</p></blockquote>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Gerard</title>
		<link>http://carbonnation.info/2009/01/06/tidal-power-flowing-stronger/#comment-526</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gerard]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 23:56:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://carbonnation.info/?p=563#comment-526</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Where can i find a histogram of the worlds energy usage broken down by type of energy technology? And is the same histogram available as projections, near term and far term? Is the same histogram also available for past dates? And is it possible to see some longer term trends analogous to Moore&#039;s law? Is the tidal wind farm a possibility? And would that technology be expected to ramp-up quicker given the previous aeronautical wind farm experience?

Gerard]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where can i find a histogram of the worlds energy usage broken down by type of energy technology? And is the same histogram available as projections, near term and far term? Is the same histogram also available for past dates? And is it possible to see some longer term trends analogous to Moore&#8217;s law? Is the tidal wind farm a possibility? And would that technology be expected to ramp-up quicker given the previous aeronautical wind farm experience?</p>
<p>Gerard</p>
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